With North Kai right around the corner we wanted to get out any changes to the crd. For the most part the crd updates are very minor. With nothing being banned or restricted. In fact we felt it was time to remove some cards from the restricted list. Blazing Anger, Enraged and Gohan’s Anger are no longer restricted to limit 1 per deck. If your planing on playing in an upcoming tournament be sure to check with the tournament organizer to see if these CRD updates will be in affect for that tournament.
The following updates have been made:
- Blazing Anger, Enraged and Gohan’s Anger are no longer restricted to Limit 1 per deck
- The Celestial fighter section was updated to reflect the recent Janemba cards
- The errata on West Kai was removed. The card now plays as it written on the card
- Cooler and Meta-Cooler are now considered the same personality
- Goku’s Farewell was clarified to be not be limit one per deck
- The Fusion section was updated to include “Fusion personalities in your deck and sensei must be at least 2 levels lower than your Main Personality’s highest personality level.”
- Majin Buu’s Kamikaze Ghost was added to the Majin personality list
Watch List – cards that will be watched and could receive the potential listed changes if they prove to be overpowered or have a negative effect on the game
- Krillin’s Concentration (Limit 1 per deck)
- Piccolo and Heroes Gather (limit 1 per Deck)
- Vegeta, Settled Down (??)
- Hercule’s Amazing Technique (Limit 1 per deck unless your main personality is Hercule. Or possibly only search for “Sensei Deck Only” cards)
- Long Journey (remove from the game)
- Black Weakness Drill (Either restrict, ban or Tuff Enough only)
Very strong changes. Now. As far as the pending ones… I’d like to see the Vegeta changed back to the way it was erattad the first time. And RFG Long Journey.
You would be pro-errata on Settled Down wouldn’t you 😉
Had I known it wasn’t in the eratta like it was previously, I’d have ran the other Namek 2. Sad times.
Really like these changes! West Kai Sensei is a beast now. As for the watch list, I’m all in favor of changing Black Weakness Drill to either ban or Tuff Enough only, I could see a change to HAT being needed, limit 1 unless your MP is Hercule could make Hercule much more appealing. Please leave Vegeta, Settled Down alone, he already has so few good levels.
Very good changes IMO. As for the pending changes, PAHG and KCon should be watched, but Im not sure how much abuse they see in Z only, especially if HAT gets changed. HAT should be Lim 1, I think that would be way better than only hitting SDO cards. I think most feel that Long Journey should have had that errata a long time ago. Vegeta should def get a change, and Black Weakness Drill is extremely powerful when you only get to draw top 3 (aka, not GT’s look at top 6) since you can draw pretty much nothing, and at least that one card was a card you chose.
As much as I hate to admit it, changing Hercule’s Amazing Techniques to limit 1 makes sense. With the retro sensei rule, its ability as a “wild card” is huge.
amazing. i love this.
one thing that still annoys me is how some cards on the CRD are “restricted” but are not listed on the Banned/Restricted list. for example, Releasing the Sword is not under “Restricted” cards, but if you check its write-up on the CRD, it says the card is limit 1 per deck — same deal with Goku’s Farewell (which has since been changed). i think even the limit 2 per deck cards (Goku’s Physical Attack / Caught off Guard Drill) should be listed there to avoid confusion and random disqualifications, but that’s just my opinion.
also, YES! to the watched card list. i still think Trunks Sword Slice needs to gain “Remove from the game after use.” as well to stop the stupid loop with Kid Trunks Speedy Flight, but that’s just my bias talking after i got steamrolled at gencon.
i have had repeated discussions with friends about HAT – it’s like one of those “necessary evils”, but if it goes it goes. if i had it my way, i’d invoke a global errata saying that when a player sides in cards, they get to search their deck for those cards and swap them out (instead of blindly siding in, like it is now). yes, it’d make piccolo sensei worthless, but meh…
Agree with the comment on some of the banned and restricted. Maybe some of us could go through someday and try to throw those on a list.
I like the watch list. I figure if I use multiple copies of most of those as well, they likely should be watched.
HAT and the sensei thing are likely their own topic of discussion. I have mixed feelings on HAT at the moment. Necessary evil may be the best way to describe the feeling. Its existence just displays a fault in sensei decks. But Piccolo sensei wouldn’t have to be made worthless: just make it sensei deck only cards(and maybe restricted) still have to be shuffled, while other cards are free to swap. Then Piccolo sensei makes all cards free swap, including the sensei deck only. Still restictions on sensei deck only cards, adjust the side(sensei) deck, and Piccolo still has a place.
I added releasing the sword to the restricted list.
With the change to West Kai Sensei, I see less reason to restrict PAHG, Weakness Drill and Krillin’s Concentration.
I see no need to errata Vegeta, Settled Down. His existence alone can help curb any over powered-ness from HAT, PAHG or KC. Checks and Balances.
Otherwise I agree with all of these changes.
Time to print it off and go over my deck for North Kai
Change back Piccolo the trained to when entering combat power!
I like the changes, but it’s a delicate balance. If you nerf too many control cards, you take away its ammo and make aggro OP. It can go too far in the other direction as well.
Taking the nostalgia glasses off for a moment, I’ll keep arguing that the game is severely flawed to begin with and you’re almost better off just starting from scratch at this point so that you can be proactive instead of constantly being reactive. Half of the CRD is comprised of stupid cards from the Saiyan and Frieza saga. The personalities from the first few sets are nearly entirely unplayable to the point where you’re almost better off just banning them entirely and reprinting the cards that you want to keep.
It made it extremely difficult for new players to jump in during the later sets because the erratta sheet read like the freaking bible. It also irks me that there are still so few playable personalities (although I have to hand it to retro for fixing this in part by giving unplayable characters just enough to make them usable without breaking them).
As for restricting KC and PAHG goes, I’m torn. I thinbk being able to grab HAT and staredown/sphere/confrontation is a bit silly. Especially when you combine this with the fact that you can run energy lob in the SD now. Good change allowing all cards in a SD, but like all combos, you have to think 3 steps ahead of the game. (Saiyan Supeme Mastery didn’t seem broken on its own, but add in Gohan 2, lob and vic drill and you have issues). If you restrict PAHG and KC, then you cripple control IMO due to the lack of the top 6 rule. It allows saiyan and namekian the advantage of simply unloading before control can set up. I also worry that nerfing Vegeta 2 opens the door back up for Baba to run rampant.
It’s also still too hard to level with slime anger. If you want to access higher levels in a non MPPV deck, you need to sacrifice tech for cards that gain anger in bunches. This is especially an issue with vic drill. The other option is clashing, apoc battle, farewell etc, but I remember a time when black could steadily level and pump out the damage as it clumbed the chart. Now, it’s hard to justify running cards like black side kick over body destruction, black front kick over chaos detonation etc so you’re pretty much stuck at level one.
Smithformeragent, I think the issue with slime anger is power creep. Most aggro games are over in a combat or two, so leveling up slowly over the course of a long game I doubt will ever happen no matter what. Just the way I see it.
Kind of surprised it took this long to unrestrict the anger noncoms. Would be funny to see some jank mppv build run them with Releasing the Sword, Energy Lob, Goku Sensei, and friends. Gohan might be a good one to nab his anger raisers.
Krillin’s Concentration (Limit 1 per deck)
Piccolo and Heroes Gather (limit 1 per Deck)
Vegeta, Settled Down (??)
Hercule’s Amazing Technique (Limit 1 per deck unless your main personality is Hercule.
Long Journey (remove from the game)
Black Weakness Drill (Either restrict, ban or Tuff Enough only)
Like all of these. Ban vegeta n make a new one in spirit of it.
and add bee 1-3 or bee 1-5 or bee sensie or bee mastery
Love these changes! ENRAGED!!!!!!
I also would be in favor of putting HAT at just 1. That card is a pretty big deal in the current environment.
I haven’t used Enraged or any of those non combat anger raisers in so long I didn’t even know they’d been restricted.
If I may weight in on the watch list. I would be comfortable giving Hercule’s Amazing Techniques limit 2 per deck (unless your main personality is Hercule) as opposed to restricting it out right. It is a powerful card; no doubt. But restricting it or errataing it in some other way hurts the meta for beat down decks, thus giving more power to control decks. I think we have a good balance right now and I would hate to upset that.
I agree with the limit 2 unless used by Hercule sounds fair.
What if HAT was erratted to “a non-restricted card that performs an attack”. I really don’t like the fact that it allows you 3 shots at Energy Lob, especially considering the fact that you can also PAHG/KC for HAT for Lob.
Stupid IMO.
By “Enraged” do you mean Hero Enraged! #88 from Frieza Saga?
No, Enraged is a card from Saiyan Saga.
http://retrodbzccgcom.fatcow.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/190-Enraged-218×300.jpg
How can the watch list not inclue ” Trunks finds the answer”?
One non combat = something like 4-6 attacks. It has shown to be good by winning gencon. I’m not sure why this isn’t in the conversation.
Could Teaching the Unteachable Forces Observation get some errata? I still get confused on how the card is played and the card text is extremely vague. Thanks